Wednesday, April 25, 2012

Tweekin' Tha Twisted

UPDATE ON TWEAKS: Hey all, so communications got snafu'd and the tweaks go live tomorrow morning. I would count on seeing them hit sometime around 11 or 12 California time. A few changes were made to the original list below because of some good- and fast to implement- feedback from the net as well as because some of the variables we thought were hooked up were- in fact- not yet hooked up. See the additions and changes to the original tweak plan below in this color.

Hey all- I've had a number of folks requesting a change log for the TWISTED METAL patches. As many of you know, a lot of the patch work so far has been changes and adjustments designed to make online more stable. However, as we get into more tuning and balancing work, I did want to start providing that. I'll use the blog- and the welcome message in the game itself- as a way to do that. 

In fact, I'll do a little more than that for the blog. Here's the cut and paste email between myself, Sony PD, Sony QA, and Eat Sleep Play regarding today's TUS numbers.

NOTE: TUS stands for TITLE USER STORAGE. TUS are the thousand+ variables we can adjust and send immediately out to players without having to go through the process of sending a brand new patch.  The last patch - 1.5- gave us access to a lot of the TUS numbers we needed to make meaningful changes to the game's balance. So while the next patch won't hit till mid-to-late May, ideally we'll be doing TUS updates once a week based on player response.

And while the official Eat Sleep Play Twisted Metal maintenance contract is up end of May, I'll still be engaged and working with Sony to noodle with these as the Twisted Metal community* see fit.

So here is what HOPEFULLY will hit players today:

The homing on these have been nerfed. We will probably be noodling with these numbers 2-4 times before Friday end of day based on user feedback. Between this change and lowering the energy regen of Talon (see #7 below), the goal is to bring the flying vehicles in to balance with the other vehicles. We may be pushing too far in the other direction today but the goal is to get it to a place most (all?!? Is it possible?!? :) love by EOD Friday.

CURRENT: Handful of current numbers but the just is they are too low in our opinion and thus don't motivate players to use the 'healing class' aspect of Junkyard Dog in team games. We feel these numbers will change that while making sure JYD doesn't become over powered in terms of XP.
Weap - Bonuses - Team Death Match 
Player Given: 5xp 
Upon Healing: first 20%HP and 5XP for every successive 20%HP  (multiple vehicles can be healed at the same time for bigger XP bonus) 

Weap - Bonuses - Team HUNTED
Player Given 5XP for healing 20%HP of teammate.
Player Given: 20XP for healing first and every following 20% of TEAM'S HUNTED.

Weap - Bonuses - Nuke 
Player Given 5XP for healing 20%HP of teammate.
Player Given 20XP for healing first and every following 20%HP of TeamMate Carrying Faction Leader.

Weap - Bonuses - Team Last Man Standing 
Player Given 10XP for healing 20%HP of teammate.

REASON: These vehicles have well liked, powerful specials but with such weak armor these cars are not picked as often as we feel they should be. This change keeps fast and weak (the core pro/con) while allowing them more opps to attack with what makes them unique. 



REASON: We set this originally thinking Crimson's flame was so overpowered that we needed to give him an Achilles Heel. We were wrong :). 

5- JUGGERNAUT: Increase damage when missiles fly in the open trailer.
CURRENT: 2X damage
REASON: People rarely use this tactic and going up this high seems like a way that we could motivate them to do so.
BILLS SAYS: Nobody here would be opposed to 3X damage. The issue here is that it's very hard to hit that 2X or 3X damage. The hit box when the doors are open is very small. Most of the time the user firing at Juggernaut has to jump and shoot a missile in order to get the bonus.
UPDATE: Turns out the TUS number to change damage when a missile flies in the back of JUGGERNAUT has yet to go in. So JUST FOR NOW, to at least change the balance, here is what will happen:

Tomorrow we will drop JUGGERNAUT'S HEALTH from 700HP down to 55HP. This is most likely JUST FOR NOW until we get patch 1.6 that has the 3X rear trailer damage working. But who knows at this point :). If these tweaks help in other areas- for example more people playing NUKE and using JUNKDOG HEALING and thus getting LOTS of XP that will let more folks open JUGGERNAUT and we'll start to see even teams more often (right now it seems you usually end up with 1 JUGGERNAUT on 1 team but no one on the other team 2 has unlocked it yet). So we'll see...

CHANGE TO: Still not feeling satisfying/pay off-y enough

REASON: Nuke games not played enough and many folks online say that the 30 min time limit that yields tiny XP for most players is the reason. Here's the exchange between Bill and I that brought us to agree on this number:

JAFFE: Players are saying they can get 1000+ via DM or TDM wins. I think if we keep NUKE 3 innings in ranked, this should go up to 600 for winning a game of NUKE. Am I nuts?

BILL'S RESPONSE: Definitely not nuts. We think 600 would be great and motivate people more to play Nuke. If players are getting 1000+ for DM and TDM, then winning a game of Nuke in addition to hitting statues and getting 100xp for that, you could come close to getting the same XP as a DM game if you hit the statue a few times. Plus it's a 30 minute game. People can play 3 DM games in that time, so it would make sense to bring the Nuke win XP way up.

REASON: The time it takes to get this set up/pay off weapon (and the effort) is not worth it when you can get the same damage from a lot less effort of a power missile or 2 shotgun point blanks. Kicking it to 90 should allow players to feel rewarded for this more complicated, time consuming tactic.
NOTE: I suggested 100 when Justin and I spoke last month on this, he felt that was too high. We compromised at 90 as I recall. Bill says the QA guys feel 75 is sufficient reward for the stage 2 direct hit damage but since it's easy to change, I'd prefer we try the 90 and if it's overpowered, easy to roll back.

NOTE: This change did not go in as planned. It will be in for patch 1.6. It will NOT make it in tomorrow's TUS/TWEAK pass. 

REASON: Need to NERF this guy. We thought by making him an easy to RAM KILL sitting duck when you froze him (since he dropped so fast) that that would do it, but we also made his energy increase fast (in order to help balance his weak armor). What we didn't anticipate was Talon- with such a frequent access to his shield and his distance from the battle at times- could see freezes (shot with the intent to bring him down to the ground) coming a 'mile away' and have the distance and thus time to avoid and/or frequently have the energy to shield the freeze.
BILL SAYS: This I think would be a good change. It was a welcomed change when we made it because his survivability was kind of low. Maybe bringing it down that much to 33 made his survivability too good? I feel 40 would be a safe change, but 7 seconds might not be too noticeable to the players who have a problem with it.  (JAFFE: So I changed it to 42 to be safe :) 


BILL'S COMMENT: QACrew really like's this. It's makes his RPG much more worth the effort. And I personally as well as other people on the crew use his RPG frequently now in the way I think you intended it to be used. We'll camp out up high and launch RPG's at people or into crowds and have a lot of fun/do really well with it. 



We could not tweak RoadKill's Stage 3 Special via TUS Tweaks yet (next patch is the plan) but we did want to buff RK a bit to see how players responded. This may be too much of a buff or it may be just right. We will let it cook over the weekend with players and then make a call start of next week. 

We also wanted to up NAPALM BULLSEYE DAMAGE from 35 to 50 but we need patch 1.6 for that.

Always have to be careful not to buff stuff w/out bringing something else down. Otherwise before you know it, all the vehicles start to feel the same and you lose the vehicle personalities. That said, it's clear a lot of this work needs to be done. How close we are on these numbers is TBD...I'm sure you'll let us know! :) And we appreciate that! 

So that's the plan. QA is looking over the numbers right now and seeing if there are any other numbers/balance issues they'd like to see us address today. If you have anything not on the list that is PURELY numeric that we MIGHT be able to easily change, tell us in the comments. I'll take a look at it all and anything we get before 1pm today (Cali time) if we agree and if it exists in the TUS, we'll push live this afternoon. Thanks!f there's a snafu :)


* RE: TWISTED METAL COMMUNITY- I know we don't have super crammed lobbies and that sucks. And I know that much of that is the fault of all the shitty connection issues we had from the day our demo hit. But I meant what I said in press interviews about this game: While a MEGA HALO/COD/BF3 sized community is always the goal, even if we only have a teeny, tiny group that likes to play regularly, I will be there to do what I can to support the game and to work with Sony and Eat Sleep Play to balance the game via the TUS numbers. And I'll always be interfacing with folks who like to play the game. I LOVE this version of Twisted Metal and still play at least 4-5 nite's a week (had some really fun games last nite!) And I plan on regularly playing until they pull the plug (hopefully a loooong time from now). Hell, I would LOVE to see Sony release JUST the MP version of the game on PSN for 9.99 one day! I need to ask them about that! :) Just wanted to share my thoughts as I see people on TM forums bitching about community size. Again, would it be great to have a bigger club? Hell yeah. But I can always find games and usually full games so- for now- I'm not complaining. 


atdsutm said...

Hi im the dude from gamefaqs who asked a roadkill improvement.

Death Warrant
-Stage 2 +10 damage incresae

-Stage 3 +25 damage increase

Junkyard Dog
-Stage 1 heal only gives 20% heal
-Stage 2 heal only gives 40% heal

Magnum revolver
-Damage increase to 14 per shot

Laser Pistol
-Faster cooldown rate

da criminal said...

Hey- thx for the feedback. My response:

1- looking at upping stage 3 damage and health on Roadkill right now.

2- Want to leave DW as is unitl we see what these other tweaks do.

3- JDOG- going to leave as is for a few days to see if the XP boost for healing motivates more to play and use him that way. If it does, we'll hear from lots more folks on if he currently heals too much or too little.

4- Will discuss magnum revolver suggestion with team.

5- Laser- not today- maybe later in week. Wanna get the other tweaks in first.

Thank you!


necrodoll said...

Why you fucked up with talon energy regen? You know how easy to destroy it with flying SB? Talon has damned 100 points of HP. You're listening crying boys that hate flying vehicles, and you aren't listening others about overpowered reaper and shadow SW. Your game broken for all territories except USA, now I don't able do play online (only quick match), stats and skins broken. And after that you want fucked up with balance because poor americans cry so much.

da criminal said...

girl- please learn to read. These are easy numbers to adjust at this point. I've been hearing Talon bitching for MONTHS and we're going to address it and let is sit for a day or two and if it sucks and makes the game too easy and unfun, we change it again. Settle the fuck down, sir. :)



necrodoll said...

Before changing tm, make it workable for all players.

Miggy11 said...

Talon is a problem, but sweetbot is a curse on this game. Maybe the nerf to the megaguns will help, but I suggest that you.

Lower Sweetbots health not sweet tooth. It makes sense too because he can fly in that form and his "parts" are more exposed.

What happened to nuke being one inning? I really liked this suggestion as it will keep nuke at 10 min like team deathmatch. I don't believe the problem is xp (most people have max rank anyways).

If you want people to care about xp then increase the rank to a respectable number. I know this is possible and it will keep the community alive because they are striving for max rank (maybe a skin or icon next to name for max rank).

Let me know what you think :)

All other suggestion you made sound great.

Anonymous said...

Here are my suggestions Mr.Jaffe:

Vehicle: Roadkill
Suggestion: Buff
-Increase damage output of the alternate special stage 3

-The alt special requires considerable amount of effort and timing, must be charged 3 times, and can be nullified by an unsuspecting freeze. The missile barrage is not guaranteed 100%. Roadkill should be rewarded a little more for the efforts.

Vehicle: Axel
Suggestion: Buff
-Revert the War wheel back to it's original state.
-Increase shockwave damage to 30.

-Axel has low armor and is a high risk character. The war wheel is not effective when in open space, thus making it useful only in confined spaces. The hit detection on it is poor. Landing multiple hits on an opponent is not guaranteed. Axel has to get "in" and get his hands dirty to land the war wheel. Landing multiple crushes only works on novices. Against seasoned players, just going in and attempting a war wheel is a liability to the Axel user. Ultimately, Axel is a high risk, weak armor vehicle that has to get in to do damage, but the payoff isn't that great, unless you land multiple crushes which realistically, is not happening often. This makes Axel high risk mediocre reward and only useful in small maps.
-Buff the shockwave. The range on it is not impressive, albeit the knock back is very good. Axel needs a solid Get off me move with his weak armor. Warthog on the other hand gets 30 for crowd control and the reach on it is ridiculous. What gives?

Vehicle: Warthog
Suggestion: Nerf
-Bring the crowd controller down to 20 points

-Warthogs crowd controller is the best in the game. Has the biggest reach of all and is highly abusable, especially in small maps. 30 points for that move is a bit much.

Weapon: Napalm
Suggestion: Buff
-Increase Bullseye damage

This weapon is quite slow, an landing a bullseye in the heat of the battle is an impressive feat, but all for a measly 35 points? Players landing bullseye should be rewarded a hefty sum. I suggest doubling the bullseye damage at the very least.

Vehicle: Darkside
Suggestion: Buff
-Increase Darkside slam damage

-Darkside is probably the worst vehicle in the game. He's a bullet sponge. Terrible handling and weak special. His Darkside slam is not easy at all to land, and it has a terrible hit detection. Darkside is a disgrace to Peterbilts. 75 damage even with sixx axxis thrown into the mix is terrible. That semi should be hard hitting. If you actually manage to get caught with a Darkside slam, you deserve massive damage. I would increase it to triple digit damage.

Thats all I can think of for now. Everything else you have already mentioned. Like: Nerfing the tracking of Mega Guns, looking into homing parameters etc

P.S Buffing Death warrant is a bad idea. He has decent armor, great speed, and a super fast regenerating special. Asking for the special damage output to be buffed is a bad idea. It regenerates too fast. Buffing Kamikaze is also a bad idea. kamikaze will become a problem when they have the ability to spam freezes frequently. And thats not even considering the AA energies.

Platinum said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Platinum said...

Mr. Jaffe, I think that the Ricochet damage should be increased to around 35 for a direct hit and 55 for a bounce bonus. Also, if this is able to be tweaked, a bounce off of more than two walls should be decreaded to around 18 in my opinion. In additon, the charge-up direct hit - 16 - should be increased to 22 in my opinion. Thanks for reading!

TyrantII said...

David, don't listen to girlwithturn

She's a Talon exploiter, always running for 300 autoaim MG's and playing the run and gun and flee for health game using only that exploitable weapon. Go check the forums, she boasts about going consistently 32-0 using the auto aim exploits.

No need to worry, nuking these OP'd exploitable air vehicles is a good thing. Talon is supposed to be the reaper of sky, and STBbot the warthog of the sky. Pre this patch they both played more like a Warhawk gunship with heat seeking missiles that drain life 10(damage per second).

Good to see them nerfed and hopefully brought in line. Especially when the best of the best on the ground might only be getting 15-20 kills a game if they're very, very lucky. Most games winners are held to 10-14.

TyrantII said...

If you need proof:

Exploit abusers should be banned, not cuddled.

necrodoll said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...

I would also say that maybe Sweet Bot should drain much more turbo to make him less useable.

I would also look into the kill streaks as being something that should be nerfed. 150 mega gun bullets for a kill seems a little extreme. Maybe tone it down to just 100 or 50 bullets.

Also I hope you guys are looking into the homing missiles and other un-dodgeable special weapons. I think that there should be a way to dodge homers without using the environment esp over a long distance.

atdsutm said...

Roadkill- I think upping his Stage 3 damage a little bit is the safest change i could think.

he doesnt need a health boost IMO because that would be tweaking a lot of stuff already and changes the way RoadKill is played compare to Death Warrant and possibly make DeathWarrant obsolete.

Magnum and Laser pistol improvements- In my experience in the current metagame, everybody is using missiles/Uzi because it tracks and easy to use. While magnum and laser are obsolete in combos with ramming because of 12ga shotgun sidearm. nobody uses the laser pistol/charge pistol. Or the magnum at the moment.

im not also sure about mounted guns, but i feel that they are also underused.

about warthog/darkside/axel changes, i would rather keep them as it is at the moment. 3 of these cars are definitely more played

Miggy11 said...

I like the roadkill health boost and special regen increase. I hope this makes him a competent character. Yes, I do agree that he needs to feel like a different vehicle then deathwarrant

Doesnt bullseye napalm do fire damage. Why would it need a boost in damage.

Darkside is fine except for the occasional problems with the hit detection.

TyrantII said...

Yikes, not sure RK needed a tweak. He was pretty deadly as is.

Be very careful about tweaking the middle class cars down. A LOT of people complain about them, but it's due to their playstyle of running into circles of fights, relying on specials and no pickups, and dieing quick.

When in reality a different strategy is all that was needed (powerful pickup runs and attacking along edges / dive bomb, divide and conquer tactics). Not every car is a brawler, but unfortunately I see a lot of players trying to play that way with them.

Ahmed said...

I want Twister and TMBlack levels ASAP!!!!

atdsutm said...

as a roadkill mainer

at first i would have suggested roadkill to have an HP increase to 180 (same as death warrant), but realize later that would make his gameplay style a bit similar to death warrant.

i dont want Roadkill to be a brawler/rammer type of vehicle. instead he should emphasis on hit n run style. by having low HP and powerful special attacks.

that is why my suggested changes are in numbers and they are very small in value.

I dont want something like...
-Roadkill HP increase to 180
-Roadkill 3rd stage total damage increase to 150.
-and other improvements on Roadkill.

TLDR : Roadkill only needs a damage increase in his 2nd special, His Health points should remain the same to emphasize unique gamestyle and variety in vehicles.

Miggy11 said...

Roadkill is slower than deathwarrant and his special takes twice as long to start up. He needs the extra health and special regen. His damage is fine.

atdsutm said...

he only needs one of the changes at the moment. I dont want drastic changes.

His special regen speed increase to 30 seconds IS HUGE already.

if roadkill has 190 health and 30 second special. HE WILL BE SUPERIOR to Death Warrant in every way.

TyrantII said...

No way Miggy. He's not a brawler, but a 1/2 car between Kami and Death Warrant.

You want to brawl it out, there's Warts, JYD, Outlaw, Darkside, Roadboat, ect.

atdsutm said...

pls dont give Roadkill a Health increase, the changes you presented are way too much IMO it should be just the special regen rate improve to 30 seconds. We are at a risk of making Death Warrant OBSOLETE.

changing 40 seconds to 30 seconds are very good already, and improving his HP to 190 is just overkill

Roadkill also has a fast freeze break up time so improving his health would make him too powerful.

Roadkill's fast freeze break up is the reason he needs to be at 160 health. He doesnt need to be a "brawler" vehicle, but instead a "hit n run" vehicle.

Anonymous said...

I think both changes are GREAT. The health buff AND the lower special regeneration rate. Death Warrant will have lower HP, precisely 180, but remember, his special charges ALOT faster than Roadkills. Death Warrant's special charges at 19.5 seconds, still alot faster than Roadkill at 30 secs. Death Warrants chain gun does 33 damage with a single tap, Roadkills does 2 points if tapped, 55 IF FULLY CHARGED. Death Warrant stage 2 alt does 73 damage fully charged. Roadkill stage 2 does 48. I don't think Death Warrant will be obsolete. There are still major differences between the 2. I think it's a good buff, but thats just my personal opinion. In any event, it's very cool to see everyones opinions, afterall, they give insight into different views and open up more possibilities to better the game. Cheers.

Miggy11 said...


Roadkill needs the health boost. His health as of right now is 10 point above kamikaze, but Roadkill doesnt have his speed or a special that does quick damage. I'm not saying he should be a brawler and 190 health wont make him one.To give you an example roadboat and meatwagon have 210 hp and vermin has 205 hp these characters are of the lower spectrum of a "brawler" character.

The real "brawler" vehicles are warthog (300hp)
junyard dog (260hp)
darkside (280hp)
sweet tooth(250hp)

You can make an argument for outlaw(240hp) and shadow (230hp)

Roadkill should be a balanced vehicle like he has been in all of the twisted metals and these improvements will put him there.

1.Average speed
2.Average health
3.Special is hard to pull off, but has a huge payoff (TM2 boomerang)

All of the ingredients for roadkill

atdsutm said...

dude, Roadkill does 90 damage total on his 3rd stage and nobody uses 2nd Stage special on Roadkill.

The mere fact that you compared Death Warrant's 2nd Stage to Roadkill's 2nd Stage mean that you are not using Roadkill well.

I have no problems in Roadkill's 160 HP or speed. These are already fine, His only problem is that his 3rd stage special doesnt deal enough damage over time or regen as fast.

I have played Roadkill a lot and always pull off his 3rd Stage special with no problems. I dont want Roadkill to be buffed at a point just to help less skilled players who cant use him to his fullest.

after thinking a little bit, i think a 30-32 second special regen for Roadkill is incredibly perfect for him. instead of upping his stage 3 damage.

i dont want reaper, CF and Talon being auto annihilated by a single stage 3 special by RK. i woudl rather have him shoot some missiles for the finish.

This will also encourage Roadkill users to use mines and employ hit and run tactics.

Anonymous said...

I was making a comparison, stage by stage and the amount of charging that Roadkill needs to do to deal damage, compared to the amount of damage Death Warrant does with less effort, and faster special regeneration rate.

Death Warrant chain gun- single tap - 33 damage
Roadkill chain gun - single tap - 2 damage - fully charged - 55 damage

Comparison: With less effort Death Warrant can deal more damage. Roadkill has to make the effort to fully charge the attack to deal damage, thus making himself vulnerable in the process. Death Warrants special regenerates at 19.5 second intervals, Roadkill after buff, 30 seconds. 10 sec difference. Death Warrant can damage at a higher rate with less effort than Roadkill. It's actually almost perfectly balanced between the two.

Death Warrant Stage 2 - fully charged 73 damage
Roadkill stage 2 - fully charged 55

Death Warrant only has two stages where as Roadkill has three. Someone mentioned no one uses RK's stage 2. How ridiculous. Stage 3 can be very situational, and in a sticky situation you can't always afford to charge up to stage 3. Stage 2 can bring you out of a jam and RK's stage 2 is inferior to Death Warrants. Roadkills stage three does ALLEGEDLY 122 damage damage (Not sure on this one), obviously superior to Death Warrants stage 2. But again, it requires more effort, more charging, and makes you vulnerable longer. Longer regeneration time at 30 seconds as opposed to 19.5 seconds on Death Warrant. Also take into account that both vehicles won't land the missile barrages 100% which negatively affects them both.

I'm not seeing how Death Warrant will be obsolete, when he has a higher regeneration rate and can keep the assault more consistently. If anything, they both seem very close and even.

atdsutm said...

i can afford to charge a stage 3 and its not situational, You are just trying to use RK as if it was DW and its not. its not hard at all.

the mere fact the RK Stage 2 is weaker, because IT WAS DESIGNED to be that way. Encouraging users to use Stage 3 and play Roadkill in a different manner compare to Death Warrant.

WHICH MAKES VEHICLES MORE DIVERSED.and i agree on how the developers wanted to keep this.

Add that his lower HP punishes poor players and players who wants to play RK ala death warrant.

i want to keep it that way, the only thing needed for RK is the special regen buff to 30 seconds. Roadkill will still play the same tactics and playstyle that is different from Death warrant.

yeah,so i highly suggest the special regen buff instead of the HP buff. This helps him do more hit and run attacks and use mines as well.

we already have a ton of cars that have HPs higher than 180. we dont need too many cars that have high HP.

i dont want Roadkill to become another high HP death warrant derp car that caters to players who cant manage Roadkill's HP and pull off Stage 3 special attacks.

we already have a lot of cars that have 180 HP and above. and giving Roadkill more hp than Death warrant is just dumb

frostquake said...

I have yet to buy the game, due to the fear of the Gods that it will brick my Launch 60gig PS3? Safe now with patch? Or still a possibility of bricking my system?
Stay Frosty

Roxas27 said...

Great updates jaffe. I hope this totally fix european servers. Cant play splitscreen online with my friend atm.
Good to see roadkill gets some hp and regeneration impresse cause he really needed that.
Correction for the post above...his 3rd stage special is easy to pull off but its also easy to counter by using freeze and shield. Its total damage too is 97 and not 120. Consider also than when its get can just cause less than half of 97 thats why he really need extra hp and regen.

Lewis W said...


>>>> Increase damage with MOST sidearms (not the mounted guns) because barely anyone uses them!

>>>> MAJORLY increase ricochet damage. I feel this weapon is useless 99% of the time so I tend to just discard it.

>>>> Increase turbo usage with Sweet Bot

>>>> BUFF UP Axel. I was disappointed when you guys gave us Axel because he's very poor. Maybe a crowd controller damage increase??

>>>> Increase Level Cap to get more people playing Nuke (people who want XP!!)

>>>> Shadow's alternate special is overpowered. New players go towards the "nice shiny pink coffin" and instantly die.

>>>> Decrease Reaper's sacrificing time to nuke launchers BECAUSE he can use his shield CONSTANTLY for the full duration of the sacrifice (if he has full energy bar)!!

>>>> (Obviously all DLC would be welcomed and adored).

P.S. The Twisted Metal fan base is a lot bigger than you think! It's just that most people are waiting until the game is FIXED online before playing! :)

Platinum said...

Mr. Jaffe, please fix Warthog's "Special Weapons" decription in the vehicle selection screen. It lists the primary Special that doesn't exist.

j0k3r428 said...

Are we ever going to get a trophy patch? I love the game and will continue to play for awhile but it's a real let down to know you should have a platinum and not receive it.

Miggy11 said...

Even though mega gun tracking has been nerfed, I still feel that sweetbot ruins this game. Suggestions to fix him are.

1. weaken the damage of megaguns.

2. make sweetbot burn more turbo when flying.

3. reduce health when in sweetbot mode. 250hp makes him a flying tank.

4. reduce the amount of megagun bullets that are given for killstreaks.(red megaguns maybe a 6+ killstreak)

I feel that there are a lot of people that have quit this game because of the sweetbot abuse. Sweetbot has become the poacher of this game. Picking off those that have low health also makes it annoying to have sweetbots on your team.

Thanks for reading

TyrantII said...

Anyone experiencing this since patch 1.04?

Every 5 seconds or so there's momentary 1/2 a second freezes, and it happens all through the match. This is horrible, because you tend to misfire and overcorrect steering while the frame is frozen, only to miss pickups, miss opponents, and even run into walls once the game comes back. I've been trying to figure out if it's a latency issue, or something new since it started appearing around 1.04 / the euro launch.

It reminds me of the HL2 autosave framerate issue back in the day and is very similar in how it hangs the image.

doesn't always seem to happen, but it seems to be happening more than it used to when it first started.

Any ideas? New bug? Just laggers?

Anonymous said...

The Roadkill buff was a great addition. 15 HP buff and 30 second regeneration rate seems very balanced to me. I think it was a wise choice to go with 15 HP instead of 30 HP. The 15 HP won't make much of a difference and it won't bring imbalance to the game. Should stay as is.

Mega Gun nerf was noticeable for me. I managed to actually outrun them with the weaker vehicles. They still home but more effort must be put forth by the user.

Haven't tested out the rest but so far the tweaks that were made by Jaffe and ESP were awesome In my opinion. Great job guys.

atdsutm said...

Axel is godlike in this game, you just have to use him smartly instead of doing the basic "brawler type" player.

ive seen axel flankers and jumpers all over the map and they are very hard to kill

people just cant justify shadow getting a nerf, because "new" players get killed by the charged coffin. How about the good players? they rarely get killed and position themselves well.

Anonymous said...

Jaffe, the new live tweaks aren't hotfixes permanently saved into the PS3's HDD it seems. Could it be possible that you guys apply the tweaks permanently into the next patch, version 1.06? Apparently, if you're offline before you sign in now, they dont apply to SP, Thus, indicating they are server sided.

Above is a thread created by Archminion discussing the issue. Thank you.

Anonymous said...


Mortimer from TMA has made a very interesting analysis on TM, I urge you to read it please. Great insight and suggestions.


TyrantII said...


My only issue with Shadow (and to an extent Meatwagon) is the idiot damage the player takes if they spam and hit their specials close.

You don't take nearly enough idiot damage, and their specials then act like a shotgun / ram on steroids, especially if you turbo ram.

Increase the idiot damage you take, and they're fine IMO.

DarkEde said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
DarkEde said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
DarkEde said...

Like the increase in Nuke XP. Would love to play more games in that engrossing mode.

darkstar07x said...

still no trophy fix?

TyrantII said...

they said 1.06, also looking into latency fixes / netcode.

Vadimony said...

Response to your tweaks and anything I read here.

atdsutm said...


thats a better argument that i was expecting for nerfing shadow.

not the reason of "new players" getting owned.

OldGuy said...

This Game Is Not Worth 10$ ! . Sony Needs To Advertise ( Kevin Butler FTW ) Cause Thiers Lots Of People That Dont Know About The Game! Also We Need DLC That Has 1 New Vechile , 1 New Map and 1 New Mode *cough* CHASE TO VEGAS *cough* at a great price . Love TM , Love the support

OldGuy said...

This Game Is Not Worth 10$ ! . Sony Needs To Advertise ( Kevin Butler FTW ) Cause Thiers Lots Of People That Dont Know About The Game! Also We Need DLC That Has 1 New Vechile , 1 New Map and 1 New Mode *cough* CHASE TO VEGAS *cough* at a great price . Love TM , Love the support

atdsutm said...

At the moment, the patch changes looks nice and also going in the right direction, but some of the patches changes numerically are too big or the changes are too drastic.


Roadkill has been overbuffed in my opinion, and got a bit more than he needed. Currently he has an additional 15 HP and 10 second faster regen rate on his special. HELL Roadkill got more significant buffs than crimson fury.

Roadkill's current changed stats...

Health: 175
Special Regen Rate: 30 seconds

I suggest he should be tweaked into...

Health: 160
Special Regen Rate: 33-34 seconds

Note: If Jaffe still plans to increase the roadkill damage it should be somewhere around 115 at stage 3 max and 145 at stage 3 "BLINKING", but this inturn will make mines less usable because of the 40 second regen rate.

If only there is a way to make mines 30 seconds regen rate and his blood missiles regen rate around 34 seconds. That is too much i guess.

Putting his special regen rate to 34 second might still make mines used a bit more frequently

his HP going back to 160 will make him completely different than Death Warrant.

Crimson Fury currently feels very good, but i think his freeze break speed has become a bit too good for him as it almost cut it into half. The change I think should be in the middle of it.

Crimson Fury current changed stats

Freeze break count : 400

I suggest he should be tweaked into...

Freeze break count : 550


About juggernaut

The HP changes seems to be much very significant for him, and he dies a lot quicker now team mates must attend to protecting and moving along with the juggernaut. Instead of juggernaut getting kills on its own via absorption shield and dumb ram.

This also decreases the health that the juggernaut gets from mercy bonus, health pickups and JYD health taxi.

So I am favoring this change instead of the x3 damage when the weakpoint is open.

what do you guys think?


Junkyard dog and Nuke mode exp

His heal feels a bit more rewarding on the eXp side, but his change has little impact on the balance side of thing, so i care little for this.

Although i havent played nuke mode to detect the exp. Time will tell about it


Talon energy and megagun nerfs

YUMMY DELICIOUS!!!! Although im getting reports of very good abusers still get away with them.

There are other changes i havent tapped into because i dont use the vehicles much such as reaper.


Other future changes that are probably needed

-the other changes jaffe had missed and are promised for 1.6 patch

-"slightly" improve magnum and laser sidearms (instead of people spamming accurate rockets.)
-"slightly" tracking nerf on homings and remote bombs.
-"slightly" improve damage on napalms on "direct hit.
-"bigger" idiot penalty damage on specials such as guided gurney bomb, and shadow specials.
-probably a slight nerf to Shadow's damage at far radius.
-"slight" nerf to junkyard dog's heal

when i emphasize the word "slight" i mean changes like Crimson Fury's total changes are "BIG". Roadkill's improvements are "MASSIVE".

TyrantII said...

atdsutm is spot on IMO.

The MG change has made it much better, as you can at least move out of their lock zones and try to shake them. But as said, really proficient abusers still might get away with it, especially at far ranged.

For some reason the autoaim can lock at 3000-4000 yards, almost clear across the map.

If you can limit that to 300-500 (bout a block's worth in metro) then I'd say your tooth/talon fixes can be put behind you, as it will equalize them fully with the ground cars.

Toothbot was always supposed to be a close brawler with his slam, and Talon would then need to get in close for autoaim to function, or they can hang back and fight with traditional pickups.

atdsutm said...

ok it seems like the consensus from gamefaqs about the juggernaut is that he needs to get back his original HP, and his current HP is pretty low.

That seems fine for me as long as the juggernaut finally receives his x3 damage at the weakpoint.

TyrantII said...

I haven't noticed much of a difference with Jugs, but then again most people kill themselves if I'm a jugs in the room. Noobs ram you constantly....

I never had an issue taking out a 700HP jugs very quickly singlehandily, so I do see how it could be a problem in a room of vets. But people also aren't teaming up effectively in him consistently (jugs with 2 gunners and 2 JYD's would be a beast to take down w/o teamwork). Sure you're roadkill if he catches you in a confined area and coming right for you, but for the most part it's very, very easy to stay outside of his Tslide and ram areas, and unload on him with the more powerful pickups.

I say raise it again.

30 seconds for RK special is way too fast, I say meet 1/2 way at 35 and revert to his old HP.

Megaguns X & Y are good now, but Z (distance for auto lock) needs to be chopped down severely. It'll do it at 1/2 mile now, when it needs to be toned down to a city block or less. Make these fools move in and keep the tight lock. Thats risk / reward!

I'd like to see Vermins AOE rat rocket get a slight boost from 20 to 35. Direct hit for 100 is massive, but with so little fuel and bad maneuverability, you almost never connect. Plus you spend 1-3 seconds sitting there vulnerable before you regain control.

Idiot damage on all cars needs to be raised, to prevent brutal kamikaze combo attacks that leave the person doing them relativity undamaged vs the 80-130 dmg the enemy takes. ALSO, player suicides needs to give the kill to the last attacker within X amount of time, like environmental deaths.

I'd extend that to Mr. healthsemi. Lot of people fleeing, getting hit by him and he takes the kill. He should work more like the trains in Metro, which give you the kill x seconds after attacking.

...Also give him a spot on the after game rundown and the official leaderboards, he deserves it!

TM fan said...

I think its really cool you take so much time in fixing the game and hearing people out, but I bought TM almost 2 months ago and I cant even get past the initial screen (I have a fat 80 gig PS3). And I haven't heard anything on this for a long time. Should I just get rid of the game or keep waiting? It's not even about the 60 bucks I don't really care I just want to play this grate game (one of my favorite from my childhood) Its so disappointing...

TyrantII said...

TM, honestly I'd keep the game, and plan out a way to get a new slim in exchange for a phat.

I personally went through 2 to YLOD deaths before doing so (so thats ~$1000 on PS3's since launch, ugh!), and out of the 30-40 friends I have on my friends list 60% have had YLOD failures with their launch phats.

Trust me, Sell it or trade it in while it's still not a paperweight!

The slims run much quieter and cooler, cooler being the key. They fixed the heat issues that lead to YLOD.

So then you'll have peace of mind, better chance of no YLOD, and a playable copy of TM.

atdsutm said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
atdsutm said...

Vermin's HP got nerf in the online part of the game to 180.

but his HP at single player mode is still 205. (even when connected to the servers)

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